Power top on the 63

[Gasman63]

Ive found many different year parts on this car. Dad had pieced it together like he wanted and some things were done not according to the manuals. He tried to install the factory underdash AC with putting the drier and condenser(???) in the trunk but just wasnt happy with its ability. So he took parts of it out but left a fuse box and two relays in the trunk along with the under dash parts. And a lot of things wired up still.
I removed these relays and fuse box and tried to take out what wiring i though went with it.

Then started pulling out wires that had been added on the underside of the car along with the hoses for the AC. I found these wires were added to operated the power top.

All the info i can find shows a breaker and 3 wires that operate the top. Also i find 3 wires at the switch for the operation of the top.

Im not having any luck getting to where rhe pump is under the top as the top is fully open/tucked away behind the seat plus i have no battery in the car.

I guess the first part is to find what the wiring should be. So if someone can help with what wires should do what. And how to get to the motor so i can figure what wire is what. I know there must also be a ground. And maybe a relay but Im lost and need to figure out what i have to start with.

BTW, the top operated before i started tearing out wires. Lol

[Gasman63]

IMG_20240517_184413041.jpg (24.26 KiB) Viewed 385 times

These two wires i need to find out where they go. Im guessing the red one is power and black is ground but i cant figure out how to get to where they go. You can see the two AC hoses i disconnected. This is behind the back seat.

Im guessing one of the relays was for AC and the other was for the power top. But again, im guessing here.

[Frank DuVal]

One wire is for up, the other wire is for down. The third wire to the switch was the power to the switch. This power comes through the circuit breaker in the stock wiring.

What the relays were for?????

[Gasman63]

So only 3 wires go to the top motor. Up down and power. Things were just so much easier back then. And i guess it gets ground through the body like a lot of parts on these cars?

I was thinking on this last night when i should have been sleeping.
At the switch there are 3 wires. If i find out what one holds the center position it should be the power wire, correct? As the other two would be the up and down wires. I havent messed with the switch. Then with a jumper to a battery id be able to make the top go up so i can see the motor and trace those two damn wires. Im starting to think they have nothing to do with the top, and the relays were both for the AC.

Does this make sense?

BTW, Where is this circuit breaker located if everything was still where it should be located?

[Frank DuVal]

Page 10-47 of the 1964 Shop Manual Supplement has the electrical checking procedure.

Red wire is raising the top, green wire is lowering the top. Black wire might be ground from motor to chassis, as the motor mounts on rubber isolators for noise. This is just a short jumper from motor/pump assembly to it's bracket. A black wire somewhere else is ???? So, to recap, three wires into motor/pump, but only two are outside of the top well area.

Center wire on switch is power into switch.

No Supplement yet? Of course you would want the 62/63 Supplement anyway, you can read them on the Corvanics website. Buying one will get you better pictures as the contrast on the online ones is poor.

[Gasman63]

Great! Thank you very much Frank for your help. I did find two wires that go in through the underneath side of the car shoved through a hole in a grommet. I know they're not factory wires but they would definitely go to the top motor because nothing else would be in that location. As you said grounding should be done right from the electric pump motor to the chassis and a hot wire at the switch. Seems pretty simple to me. I do have the 63 supplement. I will have to dig that up and take a good look at that. I have the 65 manual and I believe the 60, 61 manual but I wasn't able to find much on the top in those two books. Maybe i should get the 64 supplement also.

I have confidence that if I put power to that switch I should be able to raise or lower the top then I'll be able to locate where those two wires go as with what I'm seeing and they're not going to the top.

[Gasman63]

Got the top up and got a look at the motor. It looks very clean. The two wires were extras. Something cut off. Guessing power and ground wires that once went to the battery.

The two hydraulic rams i found leak where the rods comes out so another thing to put on the list.

I still need to find where the breaker would/should be as I havent found it yet. Im thinking it was taken out but I havent looked at the book yet.

Thanks again for the help Frank.

[Beers]

Don’t know if this helps, but here are a couple photos of the top motor and breaker on my ‘63.

You can see the black ground wire attaches to the mount, the red and yellow wires, which change to red and green after the plug shown in the photo, run through the tunnel under the vehicle and back up to under the dash with the main harness. The breaker is just to the right of the radio area (it’s at the bottom left of the under dash photo), with the yellow power wires running over to the switch.

[Frank DuVal]

Yep, 61 manual and the 62 Supplement (not the 62/63 Supplement that is available now) do not cover a convertible, power or not, since the convertible body was put into production over halfway through the model production year!

The 65 Shop Manual does not cover body, you would need the 1965 Chevrolet Body Service Manual. And then you would see the 1965 and later Corvairs used a non-hydraulic power top system. It uses power window type motors.

[Gasman63]

Thanks for the pics Beers. I guess thats how it should be. With your pics and the info i found last night i can try to put things right as it should be. Adding s Molex connector and grommet to go out of the car to the tunnel. Not likes its done now with lots of tape.

I found more info on this in the Assembly Manual. I think I would rather have the circuit breaker in line as that is a lot of amps running through the wire so I'd rather not take a chance of melting wires or burning up the motor.

Over at Clark's they stay 30 to 40 amps for the circuit breaker. With my understanding that would need a 10 gauge wire.

Next step for me is to crawl under the dash and take a better look around, having more understanding now. Thanks for the help with this.

[Dennis66]

It uses power window type motors. [/color]

My '65 Corsa had a gear drive that worked like a power window motor and a lame set of cables that went to each side mechanism. Never worked right, yanked it out and made it manual. My '62 is completely manual. Dennis

[Gasman63]

I had a few minutes so I stuck my head up under the dash and found the breaker right where it should be. It also has larger yellow wires on it plus one other.
Next step will be to get some time set aside to pull the instrument panel again and trace more wires. Im feeling much better about the rats nest of cut wires and taped up mess under the dash. When the time comes to replace the harness i will know what Im looking at.

[Gasman63]

This being my Sunday...
I traced the power wire for the top and its a 10awg black wire that plugs into the back of the ignition switch and goes to the top switch. So it is not going through the Breaker.
At the breaker I have one yellow wire that is plugged into the fuse panel on a side spade. And the other yellow wire at the breaker goes to the main Wire harness.
The pictures and any info I can find on this is confusing and with what is in my dash I'd have to say its not correct. The picture I have is from the 63 Assy Manual. But When I connect a battery to the main power wire at the switch for the top, the top operates. The seals are in bad shape on the rams so I dont want to try raise the top again for now. If anyone has better instructions I'm open to them. But for now I think I will have to leave it be.

[Beers]

On mine, the yellow wire goes from the harness to the breaker, and then a yellow wire from the breaker to the top switch. Maybe start with unplugging the yellow wire at the panel and seeing if the breaker gets 12V hot?

[Frank DuVal]

Right, the top works with the ignition OFF.

I would see if the breaker has +12 on either terminal to start. If not, then that's the problem, there should be +12 on both breaker terminals. I forgot where the yellow wire connects to get + 12 all the time.

[Beers]

It’s spliced into the 10 AWG that comes directly from the regulator.